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Visit Amendment I's column >>

AMENDMENT I

I'm a Constitutional Amendment!
Articles Posted: 3  Links Seeded: 11
Member Since: 2/2006  Last Seen: 2/24/2011

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Where are the OS X-Windows side by side tests?

Mon Mar 20, 2006 1:56 AM EST
technology, apple, microsoft, mac, intel, macintosh, imac, mac-os-x, macbook-pro, mactel, wintel
By Amendment I
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I thought that as soon as Windows began working on Intel Macs we would get side-by-side tests.

I thought this was the moment when if you were a Mac user, "the superiority of Macintoshes would be forever known," or, if you were a Windows user, "the superiority of Windows machines would be forever established."

I thought we would, by now, finally have The Answer to The Question.

As Mac and Windows sites have yelled at me since WWDC 2005, this is a historic opprotunity to once and for all pit a Mac and Windows machine against each other in a test of speed, floating points, and mHz. I've read countless articles where I was told that OS X and Windows have never run on the same box, and, now that they do, we'll finally see which one is better.

Yet these tests are so-far non-existent, and OS X and Windows have run on the same box for a week now. Why are these tests so elusive?

Here's one reason: The OS X evangelicals and the Windows evangelicals are scared. "Oh, No!," they say as they purchase iMacs and dual-boot to Windows. "Dear Lord!," they say, "Now The Question will be answered!" "Oh, No! The Question we have been arguing about since MS-DOS will now be answered! There will be no purpose to my life!" I can just imagine the Windows evangelicals hiding under their beds from the supreme truth of The Answer to The Question.

But the Mac-people and PC-people shouldn't worry: These tests won't decide anything. Mac sites will publish tests that err on the side of Mac. PC sites; tests that have Windows winning. In short, there will be no one true answer.

Besides, after the dust clears and Scoble and TUAW stop arguing about it, it will continue to be a philosophical argument. The Mac will still have those who hate it's GUI. Windows will still be plagued by security problems. People will forget about the tests. Life will move on. The sun will not explode, and neither Apple or Microsoft will go bankrupt.

But, still, I want to see these tests. I'm just as eager as you are to see The Answer to The Question.

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  • Public Discussion (28)
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Joseph Abrahamson

I'm personally just curious. As a staunch Windowseer gone Debian, I'm eager to try out a Macbook for a new laptop. I really don't like Windows' interface much, and I'm long tired of the difficulties one has to face just to get flash going on Linux, so you're absolutely right, it wont sway my decision.

    Reply#1 - Sun Mar 19, 2006 10:03 PM EST
    jrodgers

    Its not a 'windows machine' vs 'mac machine' anymore. It was really about x86 vs PPC... since they are both running x86, who cares what the OS is? I bet Linux runs fastest!

    I am curious though... I bet XP is *faster* for a lot of things but OS X still looks prettier.

      Reply#2 - Sun Mar 19, 2006 10:34 PM EST
      Erik K Veland

      Well, at least we have operating system comparisons:

      http://xvsxp.com/

        Reply#3 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 1:16 AM EST
        Amendment I

        A few hours after I wrote this post, I went and looked at Joy of Tech. Behold!
        Link

        • 2 votes
        Reply#4 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 1:53 AM EST
        Vincent van Wylick

        Well it wouldn't be a fair comparison, as graphics and other drivers are still lacking for windows on the Macintels. So I'd give it a few weeks.

        • 1 vote
        Reply#5 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 4:47 AM EST
        Vincent van Wylick

        Btw, check out the latest Twit-Macbreak too see it run. It doesn't look pretty.

          Reply#6 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 4:49 AM EST
          Seamus D Dog

          This article makes very little sense. Why would I want to test the speed of a Windows install on a Mac against a PC, or vice versa? The whole point of the Mac versus Windows debate is not hardware, it's software. All I know is that if this is the case, I don't have to lug around two ultraportables, and can buy on large MacBook Pro.

          • 1 vote
          Reply#7 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 6:52 AM EST
          MattBator

          Where're the tests?

          Although speculation has been wild about my dog eating the results, recent developments indicate the results may have /mattbator.newsvine.com/_news/2006/03/20/139534-xp-on-your-mac-not-before-you-read-this"> spontaneously combusted.

            Reply#8 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 8:01 AM EST
            David Evans

            OS-X may now run on the INTEL platform, but the hardware is still far from what people conside standard PC components. If you want to do true comparisons (in my opinion) you would want to get a PC with the same processor that is tweaked out similar to an Alienware PC. You would want to make sure the hard drive, video card, and memory specs are the same as well. Once you have established that these two pieces of hardware as as similar as possible, you would sit them side by side and start performing some tests.

            I am a systems engineer and have used PCs with the Windows OS for more years than I care to share, but I just recently purchased the faster of the dual-core INTEL iMacs. I can tell you that I can boot it up, check my email and load up the browser and read my favorite tech news site all before my Windows XP machine finished booting. And for reference, my Windows XP PC is an Alienware PC with the AMD 3500+ processor, 1 Gig of RAM, and SATA drives.

            • 3 votes
            Reply#9 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 8:10 AM EST
            Brian Ford

            A test like that is pointless. When will people realize that it doesn't come down to speed? Which do "you" prefer to use and what OS are "you" more comfortable working under are the only questions that matter.

            "I" use Mac OS X for reasons that have absolutely nothing to do with speed. If Windows is proven to run twice as fast I'll continue to use a Mac for a multitude or reasons, but the most important one is that "I" happen to enjoy the experience of OS X more than the experience of Windows.

            90% of the rest of the computer using world would probably say that "speed" is the least of their concerns. Why? Because 90% of the rest of the computer using world don't use programs that already run fast enough.

            • 2 votes
            Reply#10 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 12:37 PM EST
            Brian Ford

            errr.... "world use programs that already run fast enough."

              Reply#11 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 12:38 PM EST
              Scott Moschella

              I think you'll see tests once Photoshop is turned into a Universal Binary. Photoshop has long been the virtual yardstick for comparing the two OSes. As it stands, Photoshop running under Rosetta (emulated mode) is kind of not good. The Apple store here in Santa Monica won't even load it onto any of their Intel-based machines.

                Reply#12 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 1:21 PM EST
                David Evans

                Brian, I don't disagree with you. Speed is not the only factor. I approached the topic from a speed perspective because of how the author approached the article. You can and should compare similar applications and their features. You should definitely consider usability of the OS. One may make more sense to someone than the other. There are many many factors to consider.

                I personally like both systems. I have had my iMac for less than 2 weeks and already I have taken old tapes of some of our vacations and imported them, edited them, added DVD menus, fancy transitions, etc... and burned them to DVD. Could I do this with my PC? Sure. But the tools I got with iLife are above and beyond better than anything Microsoft provides.

                  Reply#13 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 1:26 PM EST
                  Dr Juice

                  Could it be that no tests have been run yet because there are still a lot of things to work out with a Windows installation on a Mac? It seems like at this point any speed test would show OS X as the clear winner. There aren't yet any patched graphics drivers or network drivers. Has anyone tried installing applications, or are they all working on trying to get Windows to run as close to natively as possible?

                    Reply#14 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 4:18 PM EST
                    The_Tick

                    Eh, it just doesn't matter. Who cares which is "faster"? It's about which is better for the task, "best tool for the job" so to speak.

                      Reply#15 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 4:37 PM EST
                      Doolittle

                      I agree with Brian Ford. I don't care about the speed. The differences will not be significant enough to worry about it. I'm sure if you are doing 3D animation, HD video editing/post, or editing gigantic images in Photoshop it may make some difference in what you choose, but most people don't have to deal with these kinds of issues.

                        Reply#16 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 4:42 PM EST
                        rux

                        Drivers issues are remain to be solved before we can decide on anything fairly.

                          Reply#17 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 5:55 PM EST
                          TimsTree

                          I'm a Mac-only person and I personally think it would be unfair to judge the speed of Windows on a Intel Mac right now. Besides the hacks that had to be done just to get it working and the lack of drivers, isn't there also the aspect that there are no PC manufacturers selling Intel Core products yet to compare?

                          Speed was an issue when it was PowerPC vs. Intel, but that's history now. In fact it seems like to a lot of consumers, speed is a dead issue anyway these days.

                            Reply#18 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 5:57 PM EST
                            oni

                            A week hardly counts when it comes to build times. You're right, Windows has been booteable on the Mac for a week now, but just because it can boot, it doesn't mean it's got full native software/hardware support. Driver support isn't complete yet for the XP build on Mac despite having similar PC components. So your article saying where are the benchmarks and the figures is flawed when you take this in to account. A week is hardly a long time to wait. Give it a few more months.

                            • 1 vote
                            Reply#19 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 6:02 PM EST
                            Nathan Starr

                            These tests would be stupid. The debate will still wage on forever. Use a MAC for your audio and video and use Windows for your games and everything else.

                              Reply#20 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 7:25 PM EST
                              Dr Juice

                              isn't there also the aspect that there are no PC manufacturers selling Intel Core products yet to compare?

                              Almost every PC manufacturer has a Core Duo based notebook available right now, and so far it seems AOpen is the only company with a Core Duo desktop system that I believe will be released soon.

                                Reply#21 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 8:53 PM EST
                                Erik K Veland

                                Nathan Starr wrote:
                                Use Windows for your games and use Macs for everything else.

                                Fixed™

                                  Reply#22 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 9:43 PM EST
                                  TimsTree

                                  Andrew, sorry, I didn't realize that. I had just listened to one of the twit-related podcasts where it was mentioned there were none available yet, so I just assumed that was correct.

                                    Reply#23 - Mon Mar 20, 2006 10:47 PM EST
                                    Dr Juice

                                    No worries, Tims. Apple was the first to roll out a Core Duo desktop, but I think there were Core Duo PC notebooks around the same time Apple rolled out their first Intel systems. Remember, just after the MacBook Pro was shown there were price comparisons (and some very inaccurate comparisons at that) between the MBP and a Dell Inspiron. The Core Duo seems to be more of a mobile-geared product, which seems to be the direction the PC manufacturers are taking it. I believe Intel has a separate chipset geared more for desktops (Conroe, or Sosaman, I believe) which should be rolling out soon. I think they're pushing ViiV for the desktops as that seems to be where the real demand for a "media center PC" is.

                                    As a few other commenters have noted, raw speed isn't really much of an issue anymore. The days of the "MHz Myth" seem to be behind us, now there seems to be a lot more focus on how much information a processor can run through, not how fast it can run through it. I'm curious to see what happens when the network and graphics drivers start to appear for XP on Mac hardware, as these are the most needed things for gaming. I'd also like to see how this will compare to running XP via something like VirtualPC, as a direct install of XP may be faster, but a VirtualPC-like solution might provide more stability or other benefits. After all, what good is speed if the system constantly crashes? A Porsche with bad suspension or worn-out breaks isn't of any use to anyone.

                                      Reply#24 - Tue Mar 21, 2006 1:21 AM EST
                                      Dr Juice

                                      *Brakes, excuse me.

                                        Reply#25 - Tue Mar 21, 2006 1:22 AM EST
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